[llvm-dev] [cfe-dev] Mailing List Status Update
Kevin P. Neal via llvm-dev
llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org
Mon Jun 21 13:16:13 PDT 2021
On Mon, Jun 21, 2021 at 12:58:22PM -0700, David Blaikie via cfe-dev wrote:
>> On Mon, Jun 21, 2021 at 12:53 PM Chris Lattner via cfe-dev
>> <cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org> wrote:
>> Hi Philip,
>> First, despite the similar names, Discord is very different than
>> Discourse.Â Here Iâm only commenting about Discourse, I have no
>> opinion about Discord.
>> In this case, I think we need to highly weight the opinions of the
>> people actively mainlining the existing systems.Â It has become clear
>> that the priority isnât âcontrol our own listsâ, it is âmake sure they
>> stay upâ and âget LLVM people out of maintaining themâ.
>> The ongoing load of maintaining these lists (including moderation) and
>> of dealing with the security issues that keep coming up are carried by
>> several individuals, not by the entire community.Â Iâm concerned about
>> those individuals, but Iâm also more broadly concerned about *any*
>> individuals being solely responsible for LLVM infra.Â Effectively
>> every case weâve had where an individual has driving LLVM infra turns
>> out to be a problem.Â LLVM as a project isnât good at running web
>> scale infra, but we highly depend on it.
>> It seems clear to me that we should outsource this to a proven
>> vendor.Â Your concerns about discourse seem very similar to the
>> discussion about moving to Github (being a single vendor who was once
>> much smaller than Microsoft).Â I think your concerns are best
>> addressed by having the IWG propose an answer to âwhat is our plan if
>> Discourse-the-company goes sideways?"
> Might also be worth some details on: "Why is Discourse more suitable
> than a hosted mailman solution?" - if the main goal is to get LLVM
> individual contributors out of maintaining infrastructure, moving to a
> hosted version of the current solution seems lower friction/feature
> creep/etc? (though I realize moving between solutions is expensive, and
> it may be worthwhile gaining other benefits that Discourse may provide
> while we address the original/motivating issue of maintenance)Â
I notice that Discord gets maybe 50-100 messages a day, IRC perhaps a
little less, but Discourse gets almost none. It's a very low daily number.
The mailing lists that I'm on (just clang and llvm) get 500+ messages a
Are we really going to replace email with Discourse when we can see that
almost nobody likes using Discourse?
Kevin P. Neal http://www.pobox.com/~kpn/
"Nonbelievers found it difficult to defend their position in \
the presense of a working computer." -- a DEC Jensen paper
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