[cfe-dev] [llvm-dev] Emiting linkage names for Types to Debuginfo (C++ RTTI support in GDB/LLDB)

[David Blaikie via cfe-dev]

On Mon, Mar 5, 2018 at 11:55 PM Roman Popov <ripopov at gmail.com> wrote:

> I don't understand how extra vtable ref DIE will help in case on
> non-polymorphic classes.
>

The case we seem to be discussing is about dynamic types (types with
vtables). Non-dynamic types don't have type info in the object code to
compare against/match/test to find the dynamic type of an object (eg: you
can't dynamic_cast or use typeid on a type without a vtable).


> If you remove virtual destructor from example, vtable won't be generated
> for class, but DWARF will still have incorrect ambiguous names for types.
>

As I've noted: Having ambiguous names for a type is something that should
be fixed because otherwise a debugger's going to get pretty confused about
matching types up between TUs.

But unambiguous doesn't necessarily mean "exactly the same name as a
certain demangler produces".


> It will become a problem when you need to use debuginfo as a C++ runtime
> reflection (I've already seen this in a couple of projects).
>
Or when you need to go back from LLVM IR to Clang AST (I've already
> encountered this problem).
>

Not sure I quite follow these two points - though they're quite different
from the issues discussed so far in terms of motivation/solutions - so
might be worth diving into them further to understand if/how they could be
supported.


> I wonder if  abi::__cxa_demangle guarantees unambigous names?  If so, then
> I can just replace current incorrect names that Clang generates, with names
> from demangler. In this case I don't even need to patch gdb, it will work
> as is.
>

The problem is that the ABI doesn't guarantee any particular demangling -
different implementations could demangle differently (eg: "(unsigned)1"
versus "1u" for example). Making a strict contract between the demangler
and the pretty printed names is probably not a workable idea.


>
> -Roman
>
> 2018-03-05 10:46 GMT-08:00 Daniel Berlin <dberlin at dberlin.org>:
>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 5, 2018, 9:26 AM David Blaikie <dblaikie at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 5, 2018 at 9:09 AM Daniel Berlin <dberlin at dberlin.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Mon, Mar 5, 2018 at 8:37 AM, David Blaikie <dblaikie at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Mar 3, 2018 at 8:20 PM Daniel Berlin via llvm-dev <
>>>>> llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, Mar 2, 2018 at 3:58 PM, Roman Popov via llvm-dev <
>>>>>> llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As you may know modern C++ debuggers (GDB and LLDB) support dynamic
>>>>>>> type identification for polymorphic objects, by utilizing C++ RTTI.
>>>>>>> Unfortunately this feature does not work with Clang and GDB >= 7.x
>>>>>>> .  The last compiler that worked well was G++ 6.x
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've asked about this issue both on GDB and LLDB maillists.
>>>>>>> Unfortunately it's hard or impossible to fix it on debugger side.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Errr, i posited a solution on the gdb mailing list that i haven't
>>>>>> seen shot down so far, that doesn't require linkage names, it only requires
>>>>>> one new attribute that is a DW_FORM_ref, and very cheap.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> FWIW, for C++ at least, neither Clang nor GCC (6.3) produce any DWARF
>>>>> to describe the vtable itself (they describe the vtable pointer inside the
>>>>> struct, but not the constant vtable array) - so it'll be a bit more than
>>>>> one attribute, but the bytes describe the vtable (as a global variable? Do
>>>>> we give it a name? (if so, we're back to paying that cost)) first, then to
>>>>> add the reference from that to the type.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Right, they produce a named symbol but not debug info.
>>>>
>>>> The only thing you need is a single DIE for that symbol, with a single
>>>> ref.
>>>>
>>>
>>> When you say "a single DIE" what attributes are you picturing that DIE
>>> having? If it has a single attribute, a ref_addr to the type, that doesn't
>>> seem to provide anything useful. Presumably this DIE would need a
>>> DW_AT_location with the address of the vtable (with a relocation to resolve
>>> that address, etc).
>>>
>>
>> Location and concrete type it belongs to.  That's the minimum you should
>> need here.
>> You don't need the name, though it doesn't hurt.
>>
>>
>>> No name? No other identifying features? I don't think we've ever really
>>> produced DIEs like that, though it sounds OK to me.
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> (IE they just need to be able to say "find me the DIE for this address
>>>> range", have it get to the vtable DIE, and get to the concrete type die)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> & I'm not sure what Apple would do or anyone else that has libraries
>>>>> without debug info shipped & users have to debug them (this is what broke
>>>>> -fno-standalone-debug for Apple - their driver API which ships without
>>>>> debug info of its own, has strong vtables in it).
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I'm confused.
>>>> This already seems to have  has the same issue?
>>>> Just because it uses one linker symbol, it still requires full debug
>>>> info to print the type anyway.
>>>>
>>> So if it's gone, nothing changes.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Sorry, I don't quite understand your comment here - could you explain it
>>> in more detail - the steps/issues you're seeing?
>>>
>>
>> I think we are starting from different positions here, so let me add a
>> few pieces of data and see how it helps.
>>
>> Let's assume the below is true and it won't work on OSX as described (i'm
>> certainly in no place to disagree).
>>
>> Some data points:
>>
>> 1. LLDB works just fine on Darwin (it appears to do the same thing we did
>> in gdb, staring
>> at source/Plugins/LanguageRuntime/CPlusPlus/ItaniumABI/ItaniumABILanguageRuntime.cpp)
>>
>> 2. GDB does not work on Darwin at all for any real debugging right now
>> (You can't debug llvm with it, for example).  There are barely working
>> versions here and there.  The startup time to debug an "opt" binary from
>> llvm is well over 2 minutes alone to get to a prompt just from typing "gdb
>> bin/opt". It requires 4 gigs of ram.  It usually fails to print most
>> symbols/types/crashes calling functions, blah blah blah.
>> You can't even quit most of the time without hitting an assert.
>> (gdb) q
>> thread.c:93: internal-error: struct thread_info *inferior_thread():
>> Assertion `tp' failed.
>> A problem internal to GDB has been detected,
>> further debugging may prove unreliable.
>> Quit this debugging session? (y or n) y
>>
>>
>>
>> 3. On every platform, GDB will have to continue to use what it does now
>> as a fallback anyway, as all existing binaries will not be rebuilt.
>> 4. Ditto LLDB
>>
>> So for GDB, it doesn't really matter whether it breaks OSX, to start.
>> Even if it did, it will still work as well or as not well as it has in the
>> past :)
>>
>> LLDB works, and should work as well as it did with or without this as
>> well.
>>
>> Given all that: No matter what we do, LLDB and GDB will continue to work
>> exactly as well or as broken as they have before on OSX. Nothing will
>> change.
>>
>> So i wouldn't call it broken, i'd call it, at worst, inapplicable to
>> certain situations on OSX, and triggering a fallback :)
>>
>>
>>
>>> I'll try to do the same:
>>> Currently the DWARF type information (the actual DW_TAG_class_type DIE
>>> with the full definition of the class - its members, etc) on OSX goes
>>> everywhere the type is used (rather than only in the object files where the
>>> vtable is defined) to ensure that types defined in objects built without
>>> debug info, but used in objects built with debug info can still be
>>> debugged. (whereas on other platforms, like Linux, the assumption is made
>>> that the whole program is built with debug info - OSX is different because
>>> it has these system libraries for drivers that break this convention (&
>>> because LLDB can't handle this situation) - so, because the system itself
>>> breaks the assumption, the default is to turn off the assumption)
>>>
>>> I assumed your proposal would only add this debug info to describe the
>>> vtable constant where the vtable is defined. Which would break OSX.
>>>
>>> If the idea would be to, in OSX (& other -fstandalone-debug
>>> situations/platforms/users) would be to include this vtable DIE even where
>>> the vtable is not defined - that adds a bit more debug info & also it means
>>> debug info describing the declaration of a variable, also something we
>>> haven't really done in LLVM before - again, technically possible, but a
>>> nuance I'd call out/want to be aware of/think about/talk about (hence this
>>> conversation), etc.
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I can go into more detail there - but there are certainly some
>>>>> annoying edge cases/questions I have here :/
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Constructive alternative?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Not sure - not saying what your proposing isn't workable - but I do want
>>> to understand the practical/implementation details a bit to see how it
>>> plays out - hence the conversation above.
>>>
>>
>> FWIW, i don't have a lot of time/energy to push this, so i'm pretty much
>> going to bow out at this point and leave folks to their own devices. I just
>> wanted to point out there are other solutions that would likely work a lot
>> better over time.
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Right now, relying on *more* names, besides being huge in a lot of
>>>> binaries,  relies on the demangler producing certain text (which is not
>>>> guaranteed)
>>>> That text has to exactly match the text of some other symbol (which is
>>>> not guaranteed).
>>>>
>>>
>>> *nod* I agree that the name matching based on demangling is a bad idea.
>>>
>>>
>>>> That 10 second delay you get sometimes with going to print a C++ symbol
>>>> in a large binary?
>>>>
>>>> That's this lookup.
>>>>
>>>> So right now it:
>>>> 1. Uses a ton of memory
>>>> 2. Uses a ton of time
>>>> 3. Doesn't work all the time (depends on demanglers, and there are very
>>>> weird edge cases here).
>>>>
>>>> Adding linkage names will not change any of these, whereas adding a
>>>> DWARF extension fixes all three, forever.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Not sure I follow this - debuggers do lots of name lookups, I would've
>>> thought linkage name<>linkage name lookup could be somewhat practical
>>> (without all the fuzzy matching logic).
>>>
>>
>> You'd think it would be optimized for this, but for GDB, it will now pull
>> in every symbol table looking for the name, until it finds it.  It does
>> not, for example, build a global index of names so it knows what CU to go
>> read from or anything smart like that.
>> (it's a little more nuanced than this, but in practice, not)
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> I don't even care about the details of the extension, my overriding
>>>> constraint is "please don't extend this hack further given the above".
>>>>
>>>
>>> Mangled to demangled name matching seems like a hack - matching the
>>> mangled names doesn't seem like such a hack to me - but, yeah, I'm totally
>>> open to an address based solution as you're suggesting, just trying to
>>> figure out the details/issues.
>>>
>>
>> At the time, the mangled name was not available anywhere.
>> It looks like name() is supposed to now return the mangled name in the
>> itanium ABI.
>> So theoretically, you could just change GDB to call the name function(),
>> look that up in the minimal symbol tables (name->address mappings, without
>> debug info), and go to the full symbol table info for that address.  This
>> avoids needing the DW_AT_name in the debuginfo to match, only the name in
>> the symbol table.
>>
>> This will break if you use -fno-rtti, whereas the vtable way (either
>> existing or proposed) would still work.
>>
>> G++ actually *had* linkage names for types for a long time in the debug
>> info, and deliberately removed them due to space usage.
>>
>>
>>> Have you got a link/steps to a sample/way to get GCC to produce this
>>> sort of debug info? (at least with 6.3 using C++ I don't see any debug info
>>> like this describing a vtable)
>>>
>>
>> Yeah, nothing does it yet.
>> Bug tom tromey,  who did it for Rust, not C++
>>
>>
>>> - Dave
>>>
>>>
>>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.llvm.org/pipermail/cfe-dev/attachments/20180306/11f0deeb/attachment.html>