<div dir="ltr"><br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Jul 19, 2017 at 8:31 AM, David Blaikie <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:dblaikie@gmail.com" target="_blank">dblaikie@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote"><span class=""><div dir="ltr">On Mon, Jul 17, 2017 at 5:18 PM Mehdi AMINI <<a href="mailto:joker.eph@gmail.com" target="_blank">joker.eph@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote">2017-07-17 16:49 GMT-07:00 David Blaikie via llvm-dev <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org" target="_blank">llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org</a>></span>:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote"><span class="m_2773207081377780166m_353884039871643744gmail-"><div dir="ltr">On Mon, Jul 17, 2017 at 6:11 AM Charles Saternos via llvm-dev <<a href="mailto:llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org" target="_blank">llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div><span style="font-size:12.8px">Hey @chandlerc and @dblaikie,</span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8px">Any updates on this in relation to "</span>[PATCH] D34080: [ThinLTO] Add dump-summary command to llvm-lto2 tool"?</div></div></blockquote></span><div><br>Sorry you've kind of got stuck in the middle of this - but I'm still hoping to hear/understand the pushback on implementing this as a first class .ll construct with serialization and deserialization support.<br><br>I think Peter mentioned he didn't think this was the right path forward in the long term? If that's the case, I'd like to understand that/reach that conclusion for the project now rather than treating this as a stop-gap with some idea that in the future someone might implement full serialization support (when it's been over a year already, and other stop gaps have been implemented (the yaml input support) already).<br></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div></div></div></div><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>I'm totally believing we need first class serialization support in .ll, and I have a path forward for this (just not a lot of time to dedicate to this).</div></div></div></div></blockquote></span><div><br>What's the rough expectation of time/complexity for this path forward?<br> </div><span class=""><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>& if a .ll construct with serialization/deserialization is the path forward, understanding the motivation for a something other than going straight for that would be helpful -usually bitcode features come with .ll support from day 1, not a year later. I'm not clear on what would make this feature an exception/more expensive to do this for (& why it would be worth deferring that work, and what/when that work will be motivated/done)</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div>We need a debugging tool for summaries ASAP, and the YAML is *already* implemented.</div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></span><div><br>I'm not sure I understand why the tradeoff is worthwhile - in terms of needing to add a new feature (even if it's already implemented) and tests, then porting those tests to a first-class .ll construct later. Usually adding .ll formats doesn't seem to be terribly expensive/time intensive.<br></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>The main complication I see is defining the behavior when the serialized summary is read back in.</div><div>1) Do we trust that it is correct and consistent with the IR and blindly use it? That could cause some issues if someone changes the IR in a .ll file for testing and doesn't realize they need to also update the summary correspondingly.</div><div>2) Do we always want to build the summary from the IR and check it against the summary read from the .ll file? In that case, what is even the use of building a summary from the serialized form?</div><div>3) If we want to allow tweaks to the summary in the .ll that override what is in the IR, for testing purposes, how does any checking we do in 2) distinguish between the case in 1) (user error) and 3) (intended difference)?</div><div><br></div><div>This is why I suggested emitting as comments in the .ll file initially (which is useful for debugging purposes, although the YAML works fine for that too), while the above are hashed out.</div><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div> </div><span class=""><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><div> Making it available through the llvm-lto tool is a no-brainer to me.</div><div><br></div><div>This was *not* an oversight but a deliberate choice to not do this in the first place. Because summaries are the first bitcode feature I know of that isn't attached in any way to a Module (you can't get to it from a Module).</div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div></span>Not sure I quite follow why that difference made the choice/tradeoff here different (which admittedly is a bit easier to see in retrospect maybe - now that there's been a need to build serialization and deserialization). Do you mean it wasn't clear that serialization support was needed when summaries were first implemented, but it is clear now?<br></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Speaking for myself, it wasn't clear to me that serialization support was needed for anything other than debugging/testing, since it is redundant with and computed from the IR, and I wasn't sure emitting into the .ll file was the right way for debugging. Which is why the testing used llvm-bcanalyzer -dump.</div><div><br></div><div>Teresa</div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><br>- Dave</div></div>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><span style="font-family:Times;font-size:medium"><table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"><tbody><tr style="color:rgb(85,85,85);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:small"><td nowrap style="border-top-style:solid;border-top-color:rgb(213,15,37);border-top-width:2px">Teresa Johnson |</td><td nowrap style="border-top-style:solid;border-top-color:rgb(51,105,232);border-top-width:2px"> Software Engineer |</td><td nowrap style="border-top-style:solid;border-top-color:rgb(0,153,57);border-top-width:2px"> <a href="mailto:tejohnson@google.com" target="_blank">tejohnson@google.com</a> |</td><td nowrap style="border-top-style:solid;border-top-color:rgb(238,178,17);border-top-width:2px"> 408-460-2413</td></tr></tbody></table></span></div>
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