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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Hi, Chris.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Thank you for your answer about compile tests. As I understood during looking through code of compile tests they don’t use test suite at all. Am I right? There is lack of information
and examples of running compile tests in LNT documentation.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">We understood that there are two groups of users: users using servers and collecting a lot of data and SQLite users, but these users as I think wouldn’t have about millions
of sample records.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">I think that it’s obvious that there is no universal solution for simple installing process and flexible high-loaded system.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">I will update proposal and take into consideration your suggestion about third part of test-suite.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Elena.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> chris.matthews@apple.com [mailto:chris.matthews@apple.com]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, April 25, 2016 8:06 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Elena Lepilkina <Elena.Lepilkina@synopsys.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> llvm-dev <llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [llvm-dev] RFC: LNT/Test-suite support for custom metrics and test parameterization<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I am really torn about this.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">When I implemented the regression tracking stuff recently, it really showed me how badly we are scaling. On our production server, the run ingestion can take well over 100s. Time is mostly spent in FieldChange generation and regression
grouping. Both have to access a lot of recent samples. This is not the end of the world, because it runs in a background process. Where this really sucks is when a regression has a lot indicators. The web interface renders these in a graph, and just trying
to pull down 100 graphs worth of data kills the server. I ended up limiting those to a max of 10 datasets, and even that takes 30s to load.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">So I do think we need some improvements to the scalability.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">LNT usage is spread between two groups. Users who setup big servers, with Postgres and apache/Gunicorn. For those uses I think a NoSQL is the way to go. However, our second (and probably more common) user, is the people running little
instance on their own machine to do some local compiler benchmarking. Their setup process needs to be dead simple, and I think requiring a NoSQL database to be setup on their machine first is a no starter. Like we do with sqlite, I think we need a transparent
fall back for people who don’t have a NoSQL database.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Would it be helpful to anyone if I got a dump of the <a href="http://llvm.org">
llvm.org</a> LNT Postgres database? It is a good dataset big dataset to test with, and I assume everyone is okay with it being public, since the LNT server already is.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Apr 25, 2016, at 4:33 AM, Elena Lepilkina via llvm-dev <<a href="mailto:llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org">llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span class="apple-converted-space"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Elena
Lepilkina<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
<b>Sent:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Monday, April 25, 2016 2:33 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>'James Molloy' <<a href="mailto:james@jamesmolloy.co.uk"><span style="color:purple">james@jamesmolloy.co.uk</span></a>>; Kristof Beyls <<a href="mailto:Kristof.Beyls@arm.com"><span style="color:purple">Kristof.Beyls@arm.com</span></a>>;
Mehdi Amini <<a href="mailto:mehdi.amini@apple.com"><span style="color:purple">mehdi.amini@apple.com</span></a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>nd <<a href="mailto:nd@arm.com"><span style="color:purple">nd@arm.com</span></a>>; Matthias Braun <<a href="mailto:matze@braunis.de"><span style="color:purple">matze@braunis.de</span></a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>RE: [llvm-dev] RFC: LNT/Test-suite support for custom metrics and test parameterization</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Hi everyone,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Thank you for your answer. BLOB format adds some more actions for working with metrics. We know that<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span>ComparisonResult class
makes analysis work. But it gets all metrics by request from database, we will need additional time for work with fields during analysis in ComparisonResult class. May be it will be better to do one Sample table for each testsuite, as it was suggested before.
It should be more quickly, shouldn’t it? Moreover, next wished LNT changes will need getting some metrics separately and BLOB format will add some delay in time for queries.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">As we see now problem of performance is actual, because time for rendering graph page is about 3 minutes.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><image001.png><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">So maybe it will be better to start working with NoSql databases? I made a small prototype with TestSuite, TestSuiteFields, Test, Run and Sample tables for getting time metrics. It works quickly. And using NoSQL helps solve problems with
different fields for samples metrics fields. Then it will be possible to store different metrics for different testsuites in one table.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">What do you think about this proposal?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I used MongoDB, but I know that there is NoSQL extension for PostgresSQL with JSONB fields which are more<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">effective than JSON-encoded BLOB, because it can be included in queries very simply and let use indexes.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">About proposal that not all metrics should be shown. It can be added as a field in JSON in .fields file, which describes fields getted from test-suite. To see other metrics user should choose them with checkboxes in view options. Will be
this solution suitable?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">We can make as you wrote<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">“I'd also suggest that if we're adding many more metrics to a test, we should create a "test sample information" page that the test link goes to instead of just the graph. This page could contain all counter/metric data, historic sparklines,
the full graph and profiling links.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">”<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">But the render time of this page will be too great because of graph render time. In my opinion, some users wouldn’t like to wait so long for see some additional metrics.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Thanks for your suggestions,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Elena.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span class="apple-converted-space"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">llvm-dev
[<a href="mailto:llvm-dev-bounces@lists.llvm.org"><span style="color:purple">mailto:llvm-dev-bounces@lists.llvm.org</span></a>]<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></b>James Molloy via llvm-dev<br>
<b>Sent:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Monday, April 25, 2016 12:43 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Kristof Beyls <<a href="mailto:Kristof.Beyls@arm.com"><span style="color:purple">Kristof.Beyls@arm.com</span></a>>; Mehdi Amini <<a href="mailto:mehdi.amini@apple.com"><span style="color:purple">mehdi.amini@apple.com</span></a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>llvm-dev <<a href="mailto:llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org"><span style="color:purple">llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org</span></a>>; nd <<a href="mailto:nd@arm.com"><span style="color:purple">nd@arm.com</span></a>>; Matthias
Braun <<a href="mailto:matze@braunis.de"><span style="color:purple">matze@braunis.de</span></a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [llvm-dev] RFC: LNT/Test-suite support for custom metrics and test parameterization</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Sergey, Elena,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Firstly, thanks for this RFC. It's great to see more people actively using and modifying LNT and the test metrics support in general is rather weak currently.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Metrics<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">-------<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I agree with Daniel and Kristof that your proposed schema changes have the potential to make many queries extremely slow. Certainly for the metrics enhancements, I don't see a reason why we need such a radical change in schema.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">To add custom metrics on the fly, we need to change the schema for the Sample table. Currently this consists of a column for each metric, but actually we never ever query those metric values. We never query for example for "all failing
tests in a run" - when we do analyses we use the ComparisonResult class which reads *all* samples from the database for a run and performs the analysis entirely in Python.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Therefore, having a semi-structured format where some fields are first-class columns and the rest are in a JSON-encoded BLOB (as Daniel suggests) seems totally acceptable. There is certainly an argument now that we're using the wrong backend
storage solution and that a key-value store might be more suitable, but that's a very invasive change and I don't think we've reached the point where we need to force a move from the simplicity of SQLite.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Adding an extra BLOB column would be easy - there would just need to be logic in testsuitedb.py for reading and writing it - the Sample model class would expose the JSON-encoded fields as normal python fields so the rest of LNT would be
isolated from this change.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">But I think this is a small detail compared to the bigger problem of how to effectively *display* all this new data. Currently every new metric gets its own separate table in the report/run views, and this does not scale well at all.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I think we need some more concepts in the metric system to make it scaleable:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> * What "attribute" of the test is this metric measuring? For example, both "exec_time" and "score" measure the same attribute; performance of the generated code. It's superfluous to have them displayed in separate tables. However mem_size
and compile_time both measure completely different aspects of the test.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> * Is this metric useful to display at the top level? or should it only be exposed when more data about a test result is requested?<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> * An example of this is the pass statistics. I don't want my daily report view cluttered by the time spent in register allocation for every test! OK, this is useful information when debugging a problem, but it should be available when
requested rather than by default.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">An example of why we need the above is your screenshots in your google doc. I'm looking at the last screenshot, and it's incredibly difficult to read and get useful information out of.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I'd also suggest that if we're adding many more metrics to a test, we should create a "test sample information" page that the test link goes to instead of just the graph. This page could contain all counter/metric data, historic sparklines,
the full graph and profiling links.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">James<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Fri, 22 Apr 2016 at 10:17 Kristof Beyls via llvm-dev <<a href="mailto:llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org"><span style="color:purple">llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org</span></a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On 22 Apr 2016, at 11:14, Mehdi Amini <<a href="mailto:mehdi.amini@apple.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">mehdi.amini@apple.com</span></a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
On Apr 22, 2016, at 12:45 AM, Kristof Beyls via llvm-dev <<a href="mailto:llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org</span></a>> wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
On 21 Apr 2016, at 17:44, Sergey Yakoushkin <<a href="mailto:sergey.yakoushkin@gmail.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">sergey.yakoushkin@gmail.com</span></a>> wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Hi Kristof,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#500050"> The way we use LNT, we would run different configuration (e.g. -O3 vs -Os) as different "machines" in LNT's model.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">O2/O3 is indeed bad example. We're also using different machines for Os/O3 - such parameters apply to all tests and we don't propose major changes.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Elena was only extending LNT interface a bit to ease LLVM-testsuite execution with different compiler or HW flags.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Oh I see, this boils down to extending the lnt runtest interface to be able to specify a set of configurations, rather than a single configuration and making</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">sure configurations get submitted under different machine names? We kick off the different configuration runs through a script invoking lnt runtest multiple</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">times. I don't see a big problem with extending the lnt runtest interface to do this, assuming it doesn't break the underlying concepts assumed throughout</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">LNT. Maybe the only downside is that this will add even more command line options to lnt runtest, which already has a lot (too many?) command line</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">options.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Maybe some changes are required to analyze and compare metrics between "machines": e.g. code size/performance between Os/O2/O3.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Do you perform such comparisons?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">We typically do these kinds of comparisons when we test our patches pre-commit, i.e. comparing for example '-O3' with '-O3 'mllvm -enable-my-new-pass'.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">To stick with the LNT concepts, tests enabling new passes are stored as a different "machine".</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">The only way I know to be able to do a comparison between runs on 2 different "machine"s is to manually edit the URL for run vs run comparison</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">and fill in the runids of the 2 runs you want to compare.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">For example, the following URL is a comparison of green-dragon-07-x86_64-O3-flto vs green-dragon-06-x86_64-O0-g on the public <a href="http://llvm.org/perf" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">llvm.org/perf</span></a> server:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><a href="http://llvm.org/perf/db_default/v4/nts/70644?compare_to=70634" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://llvm.org/perf/db_default/v4/nts/70644?compare_to=70634</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">I had to manually look up and fill in the run ids 70644 and 70634.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">It would be great if there was a better way to be able to do these kind of comparisons - i.e. not having to manually fill in run ids, but having a webui to easily find and
pick the runs you want to compare.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">(As an aside: I find it intriguing that the URL above suggests that there are quite a few cases where "-O0 -g" produces faster code than "-O3 -flto").</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Can you be more explicit which ones? I don't see any regression (other than compared to the baseline, or on the compile time).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">-- </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Mehdi</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">D'Oh! I was misinterpreting the compile time differences as execution time differences. Indeed, there is no unexpected result in there.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Sorry for the noise!<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Kristof<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br>
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<a href="http://lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/llvm-dev" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/llvm-dev</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">_______________________________________________<br>
LLVM Developers mailing list<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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