<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class="">When we built green dragon we tried to be really accountable for this sort of cruft, with a goal of 99% useful notifications, or nothing.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">On green dragon we curate both which builds notify the IRC and which builds show up on the main page. Anything that fails for reasons unrelated to the commit is not allowed to do either. We use the phased build approach to make sure we notify only once per failure. Builds that are red for more than a week are disabled, if we can’t fix it in a week, its not worth building anymore. Because of that, libcxx builds, LLDB and performance builds do not notify and some are disabled. When we email the blamelist, I am CCed on every email, and they are not filtered from my inbox. If the blame list is long, it only emails me, and I track down who broke it.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Of course green dragon only runs a small proportion of the total builds. </div><div><br class=""></div><div>If you can’t look at the build page, and know that everything that is red is a real problem, we have a real problem. Even within builds, if most of the steps are marked as failures, you don’t know what when wrong.</div><div><br class=""></div><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On May 19, 2015, at 10:40 AM, James Y Knight <<a href="mailto:jyknight@google.com" class="">jyknight@google.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class="">Yes, I also find the amount of bot spam in #llvm is basically intolerable. It makes it difficult to see actual people talking. At first, I just put all the bots on /ignore. Now I have an xchat script to move the botspam to another tab (<a href="http://tabify-004.pl/" target="_blank" class="">tabify-004.pl</a>). I'd recommend that the bots should just be moved to #llvm-bots and fix the problem for everyone. Those who are committing changes can join that channel, too, and others don't care.<div class=""><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">While we're on this subject, I also find the official buildbot page (<a href="http://lab.llvm.org:8011/" target="_blank" class="">lab.llvm.org:8011</a>) almost unusable, since so many columns are either always red, or else are so flaky that they basically randomly alternate between passing and failing. So, at a glance, it's impossible to tell whether the current state of the tree is good. (I certainly haven't memorized which ones are "supposed" to be red, and which are not. Maybe others have). Having flaky and always-failing builds show up on the buildbot pages, and notifying IRC, really has negative utility, since it not only is not providing useful information, but is serving to obscure the actual important failures, and causing people to spend time investigating non-problems.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Someone gave me the hint to use the <a href="http://bb.pgr.jp/" target="_blank" class="">http://bb.pgr.jp/</a> buildbot page instead, which was a great recommendation -- that page shows problems much more clearly. But it's unfortunate that there *needs* to be a separate "sane builders only" buildmaster.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">E.g. (and not to pick on this particular bot, this is just one example of many): <a href="http://lab.llvm.org:8011/builders/clang-native-arm-cortex-a9/builds/27655" target="_blank" class="">http://lab.llvm.org:8011/builders/clang-native-arm-cortex-a9/builds/27655</a> -- passed, while the previous failed. But, it's not caused by the commit, it's just arbitrary.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Or, yesterday, on #llvm: "Anyone want to give me a clue as to why this bot failed? <a href="http://lab.llvm.org:8011/builders/sanitizer-x86_64-linux/builds/18017" target="_blank" class="">http://lab.llvm.org:8011/builders/sanitizer-x86_64-linux/builds/18017</a>" -- answer: because it's randomly broken. Wasted the questioner's time trying to investigate the failure.<br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px" class="">If all the flaky or always-broken builder configurations got hidden from the main pages of buildbot, and stopped sending emails/IRC notifications to anyone but their "owner", that would be a substantial improvement.</span><div class="" style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"></div></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 10:15 AM, Renato Golin <span dir="ltr" class=""><<a href="mailto:renato.golin@linaro.org" target="_blank" class="">renato.golin@linaro.org</a>></span> wrote:<br class=""><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Folks,<br class="">
<br class="">
I know it's a reasonably valuable thing to have the buildbot IRC bot<br class="">
publishing results, but the channel is kind of flooded with the<br class="">
messages, and the more bots we put up, the worse it will be.<br class="">
<br class="">
I think we still need the NOC warnings, but not over IRC. The Buildbot<br class="">
NOC page is horrible and useless, since it doesn't know the difference<br class="">
between "it's red and I know it" from "it's broken".<br class="">
<br class="">
For that reason, I have built my own NOC page:<br class="">
<br class="">
<a href="http://people.linaro.org/~renato.golin/llvm/arm-bots/" target="_blank" class="">http://people.linaro.org/~renato.golin/llvm/arm-bots/</a><br class="">
<br class="">
But that machine is too slow to cope with all bots. We may need a<br class="">
project to build such a system on a larger scale.<br class="">
<br class="">
However, for now, I think not printing the green results in IRC would<br class="">
go a long way of cleaning the channel up.<br class="">
<br class="">
Any thoughts?<br class="">
<br class="">
cheers,<br class="">
--renato<br class="">
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