<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Jan 10, 2017, at 12:33 AM, Sean Silva <<a href="mailto:chisophugis@gmail.com" class="">chisophugis@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><div class="gmail_quote" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">On Mon, Jan 9, 2017 at 12:48 PM, Mehdi Amini via llvm-dev<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span dir="ltr" class=""><<a href="mailto:llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org" target="_blank" class="">llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org</a>></span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>wrote:<br class=""><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); border-left-style: solid; padding-left: 1ex;"><span class=""><br class="">> On Jan 9, 2017, at 12:47 PM, Renato Golin <<a href="mailto:renato.golin@linaro.org" class="">renato.golin@linaro.org</a>> wrote:<br class="">><br class="">> On 9 January 2017 at 19:04, Mehdi Amini <<a href="mailto:mehdi.amini@apple.com" class="">mehdi.amini@apple.com</a>> wrote:<br class="">>> This is not correct according to the number of “should” and the imperative tone for many aspects of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://llvm.org/docs/CodingStandards.html#source-code-formatting" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">http://llvm.org/docs/<wbr class="">CodingStandards.html#source-<wbr class="">code-formatting</a><br class="">><br class="">> You mistake the tone of the documentation.<br class=""><br class=""></span>Either one of us is mistaken, but I find yourself being fairly confident here…<br class=""><br class="">Try going above the 80 cols and defend it as your personal preference in a review, and let me know how it went.<br class=""></blockquote><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I doubt most reviewers will notice if you go slightly over 80 cols without some sort of automated check warning about it. W.r.t. the higher-level semantic guidelines, no reviewer keeps them all in their head. Just writing down a rule doesn't buy anything no matter how you write it down. </div></div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div><div>Well I believe it still buys you an interesting property: no bike shedding over “personal preference” in any review. There’s a guideline to point at and we can’t instead focus on the important bits.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>— </div><div>Mehdi</div><div><br class=""></div><div><br class=""></div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="gmail_quote" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="">The real coding standard is the one that a critical mass of LLVM developers will comment on when they find something objectionable.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><span id="cid:ii_ixr876670_1598762ff1eb8d73"><download (8).png></span><br class=""></div><div class="">-- Sean Silva</div><div class=""> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); border-left-style: solid; padding-left: 1ex;"><br class="">—<br class="">Mehdi<br class=""><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><br class=""><br class="">> There are things that<br class="">> cannot be (exceptions, RTTI), things that are important to get right<br class="">> (includes vs. forward declaration), things that are preferred<br class="">> (c++11-isms) and things that are optional and very much depends on the<br class="">> situation. The four items in the list I replied to fall into the<br class="">> latter category.<br class="">><br class="">> The tone used for each type is appropriate to its enforcement. If you<br class="">> add compiler errors or warnings, it's pretty easy to enforce.<br class="">> Everything else will have varying degrees of success, and being<br class="">> obnoxious about it has never been, and I hope never will be, our way.<br class="">><br class="">> We don't force people to run clang-format on patches, we ask when it's<br class="">> ugly and people do because they believe it's a good thing. When the<br class="">> formatting doesn't hurt my eyes, I don't ask for clang-format. I<br class="">> certainly won't start asking people to run clang-tidy, though I'd be<br class="">> happy if they did. That's personal and with the volume of commits we<br class="">> have, that last thing we need is people blocking or reverting patches<br class="">> because they didn't conform to personal preferences, even if they were<br class="">> encoded in the coding standards.<br class="">><br class="">> I also strongly oppose to encoding personal preferences with a<br class="">> stronger wording that it's warranted. Personal is personal. If it's<br class="">> legal C++ and it's an appropriate use of the language for the case at<br class="">> hand, than it's fine. I couldn't care less if you use "using" or<br class="">> "typedef". I can understand both. "Prefer using" is an interesting<br class="">> proposition, but refuse patches because they have "typedefs" is silly.<br class="">><br class="">> Honestly, my "coding standards" would be as simple as "do whatever<br class="">> Scott Meyers says you should", but the LLVM one is nice, too. Unless<br class="">> it's used as a weapon.<br class="">><br class="">> cheers,<br class="">> --renato<br class=""><br class="">______________________________<wbr class="">_________________<br class=""></div></div><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5">LLVM Developers mailing list<br class=""><a href="mailto:llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org" class="">llvm-dev@lists.llvm.org</a><br class=""><a href="http://lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/llvm-dev" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">http://lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/<wbr class="">mailman/listinfo/llvm-dev</a></div></div></blockquote></div></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></body></html>